True, but that can swing the other way pretty quickly. SEC has some really good programs.
The historically good SEC programs are Kentucky and… maybe Florida?
Alabama and Arkansas have had good programs over the years, though not as strong as Kentucky, and Florida recently.
As has Missouri and Auburn.
Arkansas and Texas had epic battles in the SWC.
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Arkansas had that “40 Minutes of Hell” full court pressure. Nolan Richardson could get his guys to play hard.
Strollin’ Nolan. I was at that game, and Mark was a ball boy under the basket where the Arkansas mid-court heave went in to force OT.
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Fact Check time: Lets look at the sweet sixteen teams going back to 2010.
In 2021, SEC had two teams in the sweet sixteen (Bama & Ark) Big 12 had Baylor
2020 no tourney
In 2019, SEC had 4 teams in the sweet sixteen (Auburn, LSU, TN, Kentucky) Big 12 had but 1 (Texas Tech)
2018 was a Big 12 year with 4 (KState, WVU, Tex Tech, Kansas), SEC had but 2 (KY & TA&M)
2017 was a draw with 3 each (WVU, Kansas, Baylor) & (Fla, So Car, Kentucky)
2016 Big 12 had 3 (Kansas, OU, Iowa St) and SEC had just one - TA&M
2015 Big 12 had 2 (WVU & OU) SEC had just Kentucky
2014 SEC had 3 (Kentucky, TN, FLA) Big 12 had 2 (Baylor & Iowa State)
2013 Was a draw with 1 each Kansas & Fla
2012 Another draw with 2 each (Kansas & Baylor) & (Kentucky & Fla)
2011 Sec had 2 (Kentucky & Fla) and Big 12 had just Kansas
2010 was a draw with (Tennessee & Kentucky) & K-State & Baylor.
So over the last 11 tourneys the SEC had more Sweet 16 teams 4 times, Big 12 had more 3 times and they had equal amounts 4 times.
The SEC had 23 sweet sixteen teams during that period out of 53 teams that danced (43.4%).
The Big 12 had 22 teams during that period out of 70 teams that danced (31.43%)
The SEC has had more teams get the the Elite 8 (16 to 13) and Final 4 (7 to 5) but Big 12 has had more championship games (3 to 2). Both have won a national championship during that time.
The Big 12’s 22 appearances were accounted for by 7 teams (Kansas - 6, Baylor -5, WVU -3, K-state -2, Iowa St -2, OU-2 and Tex Tech 2)
The SEC’s 23 appearances were accounted for by 9 teams (Kentucky 7, FLA - 5, Tenn - 3, TA&M- 2, and one each for So. Car, Auburn, LSU, Ark, & Bama)
So in looking at the data, I would say it is at least equal level of competition. Even this year it is close - looking at the current bracket prediction he has 8 Big 12 getting in and 6 SEC with 3 more SEC schools in the first 4 out (TA&M, ARK & MS. ST).
Luckily we don’t have to wait for the tourney, we can just tune in next Saturday for the SEC/BIG12 Challenge with some great match ups:
Baylor @ Bama
OU @ Auburn
Kentucky @ Kansas
LSU @ TCU
WVU @ ARK
UTK @ UTA
MIZZU @ Iowa St
OSU @ FLA
Miss St @ Texas Tech
K-State @ Ole Miss
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You have to adjust for the relative size of the two conferences. Additionally, Big XII teams have to play every tournament team in their league every year, whereas a team can have a weaker schedule sometimes in the SEC.
Who makes the tournament is arbitrary but making the sweet 16 is not.
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Yes, you play every tough team twice and every weak team twice.
SEC teams play every team once and then five teams twice. Three of the five are pre-set and two are rotating games. While you might only have to play the top team once and the bottom team twice, you also might have to play the top team twice and only get to play the bottom team once too.
Neither is arbitrary, but a league with 60% more teams will have a greater chance of placing teams in the tournament. Once there, two wins get a team to the Sweet 16. Upset teams make it to the Sweet 16 every year.
The SEC doesn’t place (marginally) more teams in the Sweet 16 because they’re a better league than the Big XII. They do it because they’re a bigger league.
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Well, one is made by a group of people who choose what teams make the tournament based on performance and/or preference. The other, the sweet 16, is achieved by beating a couple of opponents by playing basketball games. I think the first one is the result of an arbitrary process but if I’m wrong, I’m wrong.
It’s arbitrary of course, but it’s based on a lot more data than 2 one-and-done games.
And I’m not disagreeing with you, I think the selection committee does a good job in general, and after that results on the court are all that matters.
If the SEC had >60% more titles, Final Four appearances, Sweet 16 appearances, or Tournament appearances than the Big XII, then the claim of SEC basketball superiority would have merit.
How does being a bigger league help when in the time frame I looked at, the Big 12 put 70 teams in compared to just 53 from the SEC? The Big12 has more chances to get the the sweet 16 than the big SEC. You have to be in the tourney to make it to the sweet 16.
I never said the SEC was better, I said that it was at least equal to the Big 12.
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The Nolan Arky “40 minutes of Hell” teams vs Penders UT “BMW” squads were incredibly fun. Saw some on tv and some live.
The conference dick measuring contests are outdated.
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Not when you have the biggest dick.
Noted, but I was talking about hoops not football.
eta: UH is apparently tearing it up again so far this year, 2 losses by 3 combined points to Alabama and Wisconsin.
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I do think that the bigger conference helps at least a little bit. Conference records tend to affect seeding, and a smaller league with a double round-robin and fewer doormats can hurt the mid-level teams that end up playing 1-8 or 2-7 second-round games instead of 3-6 or 4-5. Not that being a higher seed has in any way helped Texas in recent years (Baylor and Kansas have had their share of choke jobs as well).